Yeah, no question mark here. There is a straight up fact. Bill Nye came out, rather famously, in a video where he said that creationism is not something that is appropriate to teach in public schools. (link here) And he’s absolutely right about that. There is not reason that creationism should ever be taught in public school. Or if it is, it should never be viewed of as science. At best, it is a kind of pseudo-philosophy as to the nature of existence. At worst, it is lies that are being taught to kids as fact.
Let’s clear one thing up here – there is no, and I mean no, evidence that suggests that the universe is only a few thousand years old, created by an all-powerful sky daddy, and that if there was a sky daddy, it is the Christian sky daddy, which creationism has a unique habit of being based on that guy, instead of the other thousands of religions that have existed before and since Christianity. So, Bill Nye is right in saying that denying evolution is not factual. It simply isn’t. However, the creationists in this country didn’t take too kindly to this. The Creation Museum recently released their own video in response. Here is a link, now let’s take this baby apart.
A few words from two of our science guys at the Creation Museum…
What a way to open. Okay, this should be rich. Let’s hear what you’ve to to say. The title of this video, by the way, is “Creationism is Highly Appropriate for Our Children.”
The first point that Bill Nye makes is that denial of evolution is unique to the United States. I’m sure he knows better than that.
Here’s your first problem – the guy speaking here is a little right. It isn’t unique in that only the people of the United States do it, but here’s the kicker – only in America do people fight to include a class based on no evidence, no empirical evidence, getting taught to kids. I think people got that.
After all, not only is evolution criticized widely in the United States, by at least 40% of its citizens,
That is NOT a good argument to make! It’s been proven, with studies from all sorts of organizations that our education system in this country is broken! People in this country are stupid. We’ve proven this. When over half of them vote for a crazy Texan man, once (against Kerry. Bush lost the popular vote against Gore), that says something about its citizens. And it isn’t criticized by that 40%, it’s denied. Those people don’t believe that there is another rational explanation. They think that a magic man in the sky wiggled his nose and we all appeared, doing the Charleston.
but evolution is believed to be false in the Mus-lim world (listen to how he pronounces it, that will make sense).
Yeah, and their beliefs are just as stupid as yours, man from the “Creation Museum.”
Creationism is certainly taught in South Africa, India, South Korea and Brazil.
Not as a science course it isn’t!
Smaller factions of creationists, probably (pay attention to that), are found in Japan, Israel, Australia, New Zealand, and Canada.
Did you catch that? Did you catch how he doesn’t know? That’s pretty telling. He doesn’t know, but he is making the assumption to bolster his point. What a very Christian thing to do – if you don’t know the truth, lie. Wow, I think their whole belief is based on that…
Bill Nye implies in his video that parents and other adults are doing a great disservice to children by teaching them about biblical creation.
Well, if they are saying that that is right, and evolution is wrong, then yeah, they are. You can’t argue that. But I look forward to watching you try.
Well you might be interested to know that I also teach my young daughter about evolution, and I know many other Christian parents who do the same.
And apparently, you didn’t watch Bill Nye’s video! He said, in his video, that he doesn’t care what people teach their kids, so long as they also are taught evolution, and not just taught that it is a lie! I guess those ears you claim to use in learning and teaching don’t work so well, or, like most Christians, you just get mad and decide to make this personal, not having all the facts.
Children should be exposed to both ideas concerning our past.
I disagree. See, here’s the problem – your side has no evidence! I am a man of science. Where is the proof? That’s what it all boils down to with me. We have to have a standard by which we value what can be proven. Otherwise, what’s the point? We might as well be back in the cave. Science has proof. Evolution has proof. The story of biblical creation, on the hands, has no proof whatsoever. It is faith. Belief without evidence. Why should children be exposed to something that has no evidence whatsoever?
Being a good scientist, and a mom, I want to be educated about evolution, so that she can see the inherent problems with it.
Such as? See, here’s the problem with where this second speaker is coming from – they aren’t a good scientist. Evolution has a mountain of scientific evidence. As Richard Dawkins had said, it would be so easy to disprove evolution. But it hasn’t been. There are no inherent problems with it. It’s a fact. It is only called a Theory because it is not possible, in what we understand as science, to have a biology Law. Physics can have Laws, but biology cannot.
For example, the complete lack of a genetic mechanism that allows organisms to gain genetic information to go from simple to complex over time.
LOGIC FAIL! More proof that you’re a bad scientist. There was no mechanism that made them more complicated. Organisms developed by genetic mutation and permutation over time. This is a force we call Natural Selection. Organisms that were more developed were able to survive, while less developed organisms were not. You clearly didn’t do your research.
Bill Nye also makes the comment that the world becomes fantastically complicated if one believes in creation. I would argue that the world becomes fantastically complicated when one believes in evolution.
Here’s the problem with that argument – you’re both right. Think about this – the Bible is filled with HUGE logic holes. Massive ones. For one thing – the story of Noah’s Ark. If you look at the details, this story is unbelievably convoluted. And not just because of the fact that, through an understanding of science, we know that what happened as the Bible describes it is impossible. You could not have two pairs of every animal aboard a giant boat for almost a year. This is scientifically impossible. It has been refuted, time and time again, by much smarter people than me. Next, let’s take a look at the story of Jesus. This is a really popular story among Christians. But here’s the problem – Jesus was a magic bastard rape child of a dude’s virgin wife (greatest cover story ever told) who went around healing people but knew that he was going to die on the cross with people saying it was still a sacrifice because he died for our sins even though he knew that this was coming and so it wasn’t a sacrifice at all. I didn’t add commas for a reason. That’s the total gist of it. If you think about it, that is so hopelessly complicated, when, if you believe in Christian sky daddy, he could have just taken away our sins with another wiggle of his nose.
Meanwhile, science freely admits that the story of the universe is complicated. Life is complicated. The problem with you Christians is that you want it to be simpler. You want a simple explanation for the reasons that the universe exists, when the reality is that there is no simple reason. The reasons are all incredibly complicated. So you are both right.
See, with evolution, you have to look at the hummingbird, feeding at your feeder, and assume that all of its parts have somehow come together by random purposeless change by Natural Selection, which is nothing more than differential reproduction.
Actually, if you believe in evolution, you look at that hummingbird, feeding at your feeder, and you think to yourself – well, this organism was the most able to survive, and that is why it is here. These parts didn’t all just come together. They were developed over time, by Natural Selection. What is the Christian explanation? Oh, right, sky daddy did it. He created all the organisms on Earth, which took him a whole day, and creating just this planet, star, moon and our galaxy took him seven days. Yet creating billions of galaxies was just an afterthought. Yeah, that is so much simpler.
We need to understand in the video that Bill Nye observational science with historical science.
Ummmm, yeah, I’m going to attack this point directly. Historical science is bullshit! Straight up bullshit. The idea behind this is that there is a form of science, that has no direct cataloging or observation, but through history, is proved. That is garbage. That is scientific illiteracy! Anyone who believes in this is functionally stupid. This woman calls herself “a good scientist,” yet she believes in something that is garbage by every major field of science. Science, as we understand it, is when a person creates a hypothesis, and they test this hypothesis, and either prove or disprove it. That means that ALL science is “observational science.” All of it is. It is what we observe and what we can prove. This idea is bullshit!
Observational science is what I call ‘here-and-now science.’ It gives us inventions and technology, like computers and vaccines. We can observe it, test it and repeat it. Historical science deals with the past. With evolution and creation fall into that category.
Again, bullshit! Historical science is when you look at something in the past, make HUGE leaps of logic about it, and say that the past somehow, without any way of quantifying your data, proves your hypothesis. That is lazy, stupid, bad science at it its worst! And you are arguing for it and expect us, in the rational community, to take your seriously. I almost pity you.
We cannot test, absorb or repeat them.
Actually, yes, we can. If you ever read the writings by Darwin, you will see that he observed how the same exact life forms, such as finches, had developed different mechanism of surviving on the different islands of the Galapagos. That was real science, done in real time. We are observing today how different animals form different ways of surviving in new places. We can and DO test evolutionary biology. All the time.
Yes, we do see fossils and distant stars, but their history of how they got there really depends on our worldview.
Um, no, no it doesn’t. Dawkins had said in an interview once that fossils were among the weakest sources of data for evolution and Natural Selection. We have much better sources, like the universal genetic code, or the displacement of animals where some species are in one place where they were better suited to survive, and other animals were in others. Something which, by the way, was also debunked about the Noah’s Ark story – how Noah had to have been able to spread all the animals all over the world. Our worldview has NOTHING to do with scientific knowledge. Science is what can be tested and proven. We can test how old the universe is, by looking at the distance between stars, and radio-metric dating. You are lying!
Do we start with man’s ideas about the past, who wasn’t here during the billions of years of Earth’s history? Or do we start with the Bible? The written revelation of the eyewitness account of the eternal God, who created it all?
Oh god, you’re making this argument? Really?! Man, there have been whole groups of people who have debunked all the lies, contradictions and the straight-up bullshit that is written about in the Bible. How can you Christians still appeal to this as fact when we in the rational community are so aware that it isn’t?! Ugh, this is so stupid! You’re arguing with Bill Nye and science with superstition. That is so amazing to me.
Rather than being inconsistent, as Bill Nye states, observational science confirms the literal history in Genesis.
Take a moment. Let that sink in. She is saying that “observational science” (a bullshit term) confirms the “literal history” of Genesis. Never mind that real science has said that this universe is billions of years old, and there is NO evidence with empirical data that backs up the Christian story. None. This was pulled out of this woman’s ass.
The second point that Bill makes in his video is that evolution is fundamental to all life science. That life science can’t be practiced without it.
He’s absolutely right. You cannot look at the growth and development of life on Earth without this basis of understanding. It can’t be done. But I look forward to the first speaker trying.
This is certainly not the case. The evolutionist, Adam Wilkins, publishing in BioEssays, volume 22, no. 12, says as follows – ‘while a great majority of biologists would probably agree that nothing in biology makes sense without evolution,’ yet he said, ‘yet most can conduct their work happily without particular reference to evolutionary ideas.’
Well, I’m glad their happy. Meanwhile, they aren’t accurate. The study of the growth of life on Earth cannot be done without acknowledging that life has evolved, and is continuing to evolve. It is an on-going process. So, whether or not they are happy is immaterial.
He concluded that evolution would appear to be an indispensable and unifying idea, and at the same time, a highly superfluous one.
And he is dead wrong. Go figure. So, that was the end of their refutation of Bill Nye’s video. Seeing the problems with it? Don’t take these people seriously. They are lying to you.
Until next time, a quote,
“If you tell the truth, you don’t have to remember anything.” -Mark Twain